Comments on: Tories “demolish” Brown with £12bn efficiency plans http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/ Right-leaning Blackpool blog covering South Shore, North Shore, Marton, Bispham, Cleveleys and the rest of the Fylde discussing politics, local life, tourism, national issues and the rest of the world. Lively discussions encouraged! Tue, 22 May 2012 16:29:52 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: Harold http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6443 Harold Sun, 11 Apr 2010 15:53:05 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6443 count me in as well TB! count me in as well TB!

]]> By: True Blackpudlian http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6441 True Blackpudlian Sun, 11 Apr 2010 15:46:46 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6441 Yes John, I guess that is what I mean there is too much money being spent and in the wrong places. I disagree on the points about managers. There is nothing wrong with having some managers because I am trained to treat patients not be a manager. But I feel there is too many needlessly costing a lot of money and I feel there is far too much interference from the Government. I will be glad to see the back of that slimy toad Andy Burnham next month as Health Secretary. Yes John, I guess that is what I mean there is too much money being spent and in the wrong places. I disagree on the points about managers. There is nothing wrong with having some managers because I am trained to treat patients not be a manager. But I feel there is too many needlessly costing a lot of money and I feel there is far too much interference from the Government. I will be glad to see the back of that slimy toad Andy Burnham next month as Health Secretary.

]]> By: Harold http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6439 Harold Sun, 11 Apr 2010 14:09:25 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6439 They may ell do John,but the same reason from 2 different people on 2 different occasions? Too much of a coincidence? They may ell do John,but the same reason from 2 different people on 2 different occasions?

Too much of a coincidence?

]]> By: john http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6436 john Sun, 11 Apr 2010 13:42:53 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6436 TB you are confusing me now are you saying the NHS is better now but its costing to much and we should cut back on services. Or are you saying its been mismanaged which all available data sort of says its not. I would also be interested to know what you don't agree with and why. Harold I do understand why nurses want to stop being nurses I also understand why people want to leave one organisation and join another. Just don’t feel the paperwork thing is the reason its just a excuse they are giving. TB you are confusing me now are you saying the NHS is better now but its costing to much and we should cut back on services. Or are you saying its been mismanaged which all available data sort of says its not. I would also be interested to know what you don’t agree with and why.
Harold I do understand why nurses want to stop being nurses I also understand why people want to leave one organisation and join another. Just don’t feel the paperwork thing is the reason its just a excuse they are giving.

]]> By: Harold http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6423 Harold Sun, 11 Apr 2010 00:04:06 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6423 John the comments were made by nurses who showed me round the hospital, I dont know what positions they held, but to get that kind of responsse when I asked them how things were shocked me.This was the VIC and both said they were looking for jobs OUTSIDE the hospital. It didnt inspire me with confidence . If you went to Tescos and each occasion were told that things were bad, and that cashiers were wanting out,wouldnt you think, whats going on here? John the comments were made by nurses who showed me round the hospital, I dont know what positions they held, but to get that kind of responsse when I asked them how things were shocked me.This was the VIC and both said they were looking for jobs OUTSIDE the hospital.
It didnt inspire me with confidence
.
If you went to Tescos and each occasion were told that things were bad, and that cashiers were wanting out,wouldnt you think, whats going on here?

]]> By: True Blackpudlian http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6422 True Blackpudlian Sat, 10 Apr 2010 23:49:27 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6422 That is a very good post John, I don't agree with all of it, but some excellent points. I see what you mean about the life-saving drugs but what I am saying is that money that the trusts refuse to spend on the drug is being squandered on some non-cause. I agree it is a question of benefit the many who need those operations over the few who need the drug, we don't have a bottomless pit of money like Labour seems to think. That is a very good post John, I don’t agree with all of it, but some excellent points. I see what you mean about the life-saving drugs but what I am saying is that money that the trusts refuse to spend on the drug is being squandered on some non-cause. I agree it is a question of benefit the many who need those operations over the few who need the drug, we don’t have a bottomless pit of money like Labour seems to think.

]]> By: Troobloo http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6420 Troobloo Sat, 10 Apr 2010 22:44:45 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6420 Good post John, this is the kind of view I have heard from other (unbiased) NHS staff. Good post John, this is the kind of view I have heard from other (unbiased) NHS staff.

]]> By: john http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6418 john Sat, 10 Apr 2010 22:34:33 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6418 Just re read this post could have done it a bit better. it does jump about a bit but i think you can get my point. Hopfully Just re read this post could have done it a bit better. it does jump about a bit but i think you can get my point. Hopfully

]]> By: john http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6417 john Sat, 10 Apr 2010 22:33:17 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6417 Well Phil if we are agreed that the NHS is better now then 13 years ago you now ask a very difficult question. Was the money well spent? In part the answer is clearly yes people were dying from all sort of preventable deaths because of the stay on the waiting lists. The organisation of hospitals and specialty centres under the government was also money well spent. To a large part investing in training for healthcare professionals has paid off look at the jobs done by non doctors which sucked up so much of the medic’s time and this now releases them to do more. Again in the main investing in managers has also paid of (I know this is a unpopular view but look at how much time consultants spend with patient care now compared to before. Phil your story of all orthos gone on holiday at the same time I think someone lied to you. I know in the NHS hospitals from which we get our patients and consultants this cannot happen. It did before this government took the power of the doctors but no longer.). Waste in the NHS is at a record low (still high compared to my sector)but this does point to good management. Now to your question phil is it cost beneficial? In truth I don’t think it is the NHS is clearly trying to do too much. Under this government the NHS has improved beyond compare to what it was. I feel it is better ready to meet the new challenges then it has ever been before. Do I feel the Labour government is ready and willing to make the next bold steps, No I don’t. The NHS in my view needs to cut down on what it treats in what services it offers. This government will never do this. TB feels that more resources should be poured into the NHS (more CT scanners). This can’t go on in the paper you read every day of so and so denied life saving cancer drug. We all know why this happens one patient having three extra years of life or 200 hip operations or 800 cataracts procedures. A line does have to be drawn. Medics will not draw this line nor should they this is the choice of our elective government. Now phil where has this government failed? One of its big failings is the GPs these are paid for by the NHS but are not run by them but by the doctors who own them. The GPs should be brought into the NHS as soon as possible this government is trying with the super clinics. It is worth noting that the GPs (doctors) are fighting tooth and nail to stop these clinics telling all sorts of lies about them. I will take you as an example why the GPs are failing us. You went to your GP with a simple joint complaint; the GP you saw had little knowledge of joints or orthopaedics so he fobs you off rather then admitting it. This clearly happened a few times before you where referred. The GP practice should have offered to do the injection for you but with no direct government control on how they operate they can do what they want. If you went to a super clinic it should operate something like this. You go in you say you got a joint pain the orthopaedic specialist in the centre see you (this could take time depending on the patients which come in that day but at least you see a doctor which will help you). The doctor diagnoses your problem (or says this isn’t joint pain it’s something else and it’s a referred pain he will then hopeful send you to a doctor in the centre who can help you) and then offers you treatment. This is how it should run but it will take money away from GPs all ready up and running and these practices will fight to stop these clinics from ever opening. One final point to Harold don’t trust nurses who say paper work has increased by any large amount. What they are really saying is the managers are now making sure we are doing our paperwork correctly and not skipping things. Well Phil if we are agreed that the NHS is better now then 13 years ago you now ask a very difficult question. Was the money well spent? In part the answer is clearly yes people were dying from all sort of preventable deaths because of the stay on the waiting lists. The organisation of hospitals and specialty centres under the government was also money well spent. To a large part investing in training for healthcare professionals has paid off look at the jobs done by non doctors which sucked up so much of the medic’s time and this now releases them to do more. Again in the main investing in managers has also paid of (I know this is a unpopular view but look at how much time consultants spend with patient care now compared to before. Phil your story of all orthos gone on holiday at the same time I think someone lied to you. I know in the NHS hospitals from which we get our patients and consultants this cannot happen. It did before this government took the power of the doctors but no longer.). Waste in the NHS is at a record low (still high compared to my sector)but this does point to good management.
Now to your question phil is it cost beneficial? In truth I don’t think it is the NHS is clearly trying to do too much. Under this government the NHS has improved beyond compare to what it was. I feel it is better ready to meet the new challenges then it has ever been before. Do I feel the Labour government is ready and willing to make the next bold steps, No I don’t. The NHS in my view needs to cut down on what it treats in what services it offers. This government will never do this.
TB feels that more resources should be poured into the NHS (more CT scanners). This can’t go on in the paper you read every day of so and so denied life saving cancer drug. We all know why this happens one patient having three extra years of life or 200 hip operations or 800 cataracts procedures. A line does have to be drawn. Medics will not draw this line nor should they this is the choice of our elective government.

Now phil where has this government failed? One of its big failings is the GPs these are paid for by the NHS but are not run by them but by the doctors who own them. The GPs should be brought into the NHS as soon as possible this government is trying with the super clinics. It is worth noting that the GPs (doctors) are fighting tooth and nail to stop these clinics telling all sorts of lies about them.
I will take you as an example why the GPs are failing us. You went to your GP with a simple joint complaint; the GP you saw had little knowledge of joints or orthopaedics so he fobs you off rather then admitting it. This clearly happened a few times before you where referred. The GP practice should have offered to do the injection for you but with no direct government control on how they operate they can do what they want. If you went to a super clinic it should operate something like this.
You go in you say you got a joint pain the orthopaedic specialist in the centre see you (this could take time depending on the patients which come in that day but at least you see a doctor which will help you). The doctor diagnoses your problem (or says this isn’t joint pain it’s something else and it’s a referred pain he will then hopeful send you to a doctor in the centre who can help you) and then offers you treatment.
This is how it should run but it will take money away from GPs all ready up and running and these practices will fight to stop these clinics from ever opening.

One final point to Harold don’t trust nurses who say paper work has increased by any large amount. What they are really saying is the managers are now making sure we are doing our paperwork correctly and not skipping things.

]]> By: Harold http://philtheone.com/2010/04/tories-demolish-brown-with-12bn-efficiency-plans/#comment-6406 Harold Sat, 10 Apr 2010 16:58:23 +0000 http://philtheone.com/?p=2088#comment-6406 Hit the nail on the head Phil,last 2 times I went to hospital, on both occasions both nurses said they wanted out,due to the excess red tape etc;it shocked me. Hit the nail on the head Phil,last 2 times I went to hospital, on both occasions both nurses said they wanted out,due to the excess red tape etc;it shocked me.

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